He didn’t?
ra·tion·al·ize [rash-uh-nl-ahyz, rash-nl-ahyz] verb, -ized, -iz·ing.
to invent explanations for acts, opinions, etc., that are actually based on other causes: They tried to defend the man in question so it would appear that he was not guilty of lying, it was obvious they were just rationalizing.
What do you think? “It depends on what the meaning of the words ‘is’ is.”
46 Comments
October 18, 2007 at 11:46 pm
I think it’s hilarious that he pronouns her name wrong. So I guess you could say he didn’t ever link Caroline Lyders to the beach girl but he linked Carolyn Lyder..j/k. But it must be love if after 4 months you still don’t know her name.
October 19, 2007 at 12:51 am
A rose by any other name.
Lyders/Lyder, you know, whatever. He got the first name - right on! And yo, why doesn’t he know if she’s there in the audience or not? Oh yeah, he’s j/k around. *rolling my eyes*
Cheers baby, glad you’re keepin on truckin.
October 19, 2007 at 12:52 am
MFOYA, thank you for finding that clip! I love it….he says so much without even meaning to. And you gotta wonder why he invited her out on stage at all. How embarrassing for everybody.
October 19, 2007 at 1:31 am
Is - present plural to occupy a place or position: The book is on the table.
October 19, 2007 at 1:33 am
I lurk here occasionally and really have no opinion one way or the other except to say that Taylor clearly says that her name is “Caroline Lyders”. I don’t understand how that can be misinterpreted except maybe because of his accent. I’m Southern too so it’s sounds fine to me. There’s definitely an “s” at the end of the name he speaks.
October 19, 2007 at 3:35 am
She asked Taylor the question, lights were in his face, but, he still looked into the audience to find her, yes, he said, Caroline Lyders - I know the Birminham, Alabama accent very well. He wasn’t asked if she was on the beach with him, everyone knows he was, including you Mfoya, LMAO.
October 19, 2007 at 4:06 am
sounds like caroline to me too
October 19, 2007 at 4:07 am
he sure was nervous wasn’t he, looked like he would have a stroke
October 19, 2007 at 6:04 am
But when asked about the woman he’s seeing, the becah pics, he implies it’s her by looking around for her, saying her name. Everyone assumes he’s answering the questions positively by bringing up her name and looking around for her.
Makes me wonder what question he would not answer about her….
October 19, 2007 at 6:13 am
southern accent or not, he drops the ‘S’ and clearly pronounces Lyder not Lyders, although he does say Caro-line. Moot point, as it is, he is answering her question about the woman in the internet beach pics by looking around and saying she’s here somewhere and when asked her name states it.
October 19, 2007 at 7:14 am
Ok He is saying it with the s. I hear it and so does my husband and kids. It is plain as day that he says it right.
October 19, 2007 at 8:09 am
There is a stalling “S” somewhere around there. Sounds like a name he hasn’t said very often. LOL. Anyhow that’s not what this topic is about is it? Isn’t this topic about whether he says she is the woman on the beach? I believe he makes it VERY clear that Caroline is the woman on the beach. The only other thing he could have said would be “Yes, Caroline is the woman on the beach” but real people don’t speak that way. He answered Janice’s question about the woman in the pictures by saying yes she is here right now.No if and’s or buts about it.
October 19, 2007 at 8:27 am
ROFLMAO!! First time I’m seeing this clip. First of all, could he be any more fidgety?!?! Looked like a nervous wreck, totally freaking out. And, nope, there was no “S” at the end of her name. WTF does a southern accent have to do with it? Are you saying southerners can’t pronounce an “s”? Especially when it’s in the name of their (supposed) gf? You guys kill me!
October 19, 2007 at 8:31 am
And on topic, he is asked about the woman on the beach: He starts looking around like a maniac (ignoring facing the interviewer and answering her question point blank - hmmm, can’t look her in the eye…
then says, “She might be here.” Then says her name - or a reasonable facsimile of her name (LOL!)
So, (to his credit) he was squirming when he lied, but if you follow the bread crumb trail, he said the woman on the beach was CL.
October 19, 2007 at 8:50 am
“Then says her name - or a reasonable facsimile of her name (LOL!)”
That’s funny. It’s really not that he pronounces her name well or not (minor point) but he makes the association of CL and beach girl. That’s when I heard those who heard that and knew differently cringed.
October 19, 2007 at 9:14 am
If CL had come on stage as he wanted her to, that would have put the beach girl=CL=girlfriend relationship in concrete. That’s a false equation (as we know now) but it would have been much harder to break fan perceptions that CL wasn’t the g/f AND she wasn’t the beachie.
I still don’t know why CL balked for that possibly pivotal moment in the spotlight. Conscience?
October 19, 2007 at 10:31 am
It was probably preplanned that he would say it and that she wouldn’t come up. It would have been weird for Miss “I don’t discuss my personal life” to get up there and…discuss her personal life. Because what the hell else would she talk about when she got up there? The latest lunchenette closing in Milwaukee?
October 19, 2007 at 10:35 am
Sounds like to me that he didn’t pronounce her last name very well. It’s hard to tell with his Southern accent. He clearly implies that Caroline is the woman on the beach, so there’s no question about that. How odd that he wanted to bring her on stage and you have to ask yourself, “what the heck for”? Men generally don’t want to share their personal relationships with an audience. There’s a definite motive there.
October 19, 2007 at 10:36 am
Junebug,
I would have thought that she would have come on stage, taken a bow with him and left, or stayed quiet on the sofa but leaving the spotlight on him. My sense is it wasn’t pre-planned because the whole moment was very awkward.
October 19, 2007 at 10:43 am
votem, I agree with you. I don’t think it was pre-planned either. I think Taylor’s reasoning behind that was “this lady wants publicity and the spotlight, hell, I’ll give you the spotlight, c’mon up here with me”.
October 19, 2007 at 10:51 am
I also think the only reason she was at this event at all, was because people would have started to question the relationship, thinking, “well, if that’s his GF, how come she’s not here with him”. In other words, it was all for show.
October 19, 2007 at 11:15 am
It had to be pre-planned. Otherwise, he would have risked her actually coming up there and saying God-knows-what in response to Janice’s questions. It would have derailed the entire event because the focus would have shifted to her.
Just because some in the audience experienced it as awkward doesn’t mean it wasn’t planned. His instincts on how all of this would play out has sucked from day 1. He has misjudged everything. This would just be one more thing.
October 19, 2007 at 11:23 am
I think it’s his southern drawl that makes him pronounce her name wrong. But, after he says her name, throughout the rest of the interview, he’s constantly looking over his shoulder to see if she’s there.
His being fidgety is nothing new. He’s been that way since the first time most of us laid eyes on him.
If she really wanted the publicty, wouldn’t she have come out? That was her perfect opportunity.
I do remain on the fence.
But, I do admit that there are some strange things that cannot be explained, such as the height and teeth discrepancies.
The only thing I can think is that she didn’t want to be known as “the girl on the beach.” and that’s why she didn’t come out.
What a totally different scenario it would have been, if she would have walked out. Nobody has really seen them interact with one another. Except a few from afar.
I have seen them together eating lunch in front of quite a few fans at an outside venue. There was no body language at all.
October 19, 2007 at 11:26 am
SimonAteMyTaco-what do you mean by “no body language?”
October 19, 2007 at 11:33 am
What I mean by no body language is, you know how when you’re newly in love and you can’t keep your hands off one another or stop looking at one another..
Well.. he was eating, and she was staring into space. Every once in awhile she would turn her head to see if anyone was watching them. Which, there were quite a few of us. It was more like a
territorial thing, because if she thought someone was looking, she would just slightly touch his back and turn back around with a smirk on her face.
Not that I blame her, because most women in her postion would probably do the same.
There was just something not totally right. I wish I could find the right words.
October 19, 2007 at 11:35 am
Thanks for the scoop, SimonAteMyTaco!
October 19, 2007 at 11:43 am
SimonAteMyTaco,
That was all an act. When you are in love, you are totally oblivious to people around you. Think back to when you were in love in someone, especially the beginning stages, you don’t notice people around you.
October 19, 2007 at 11:58 am
I agree Simon, no chemistry between them at all.
I too witnessed them together, at Big Flats, June 15. Besides the fact that she looked like a boy next to him, they both looked uneasy and uncomfortable. There were quite a few of us fans observing them, at one point fairly close-up, and she looked more nervous than he did. But never got the “couple” vibe at all.
October 19, 2007 at 12:11 pm
I might be wrong about this so please correct me if I am. I think I remember reading that she arrived late to the bookreading. I think Taylor knew he was safe to ask her to join them because he knew she wasn’t there yet.
October 19, 2007 at 12:19 pm
“His instincts on how all of this would play out has sucked from day 1. He has misjudged everything. This would just be one more thing.”
Didn’t people start questioning this after this event? I know I saw posts from people who saw her at this event and said that no way was she the same woman they saw in the beach photos.
October 19, 2007 at 12:22 pm
HellsBells that’s where I saw them too.
October 19, 2007 at 12:33 pm
SimonAteMyTaco-That was interesting. This whole thing has seemed odd. But I am one who is just willing to let it play out. In fact I just have this feeling it would play out a lot faster if everyone would just drop it. But thats just an opinion, sure could be wrong.
October 19, 2007 at 12:45 pm
interesting observations, simon, hells, even in pictures of them (the few that there are) there appears no body language. I agree, if they were in love, you don’t give a shit who is looking, you hold hands, kiss, cuddle even in public. I know I did and everyone I know does. Especially new love, Taylor is shy but not that shy. This whole thing just looked too forced from the get go.
October 19, 2007 at 1:14 pm
Has anyone read that “new book” started by some nut job on the booger board. It is scary, scary. This fanfiction crap amazes me. No wonder Taylor looks uncomfortable when approached at shows. These people are scarrrrrrrrrrrrry.
October 19, 2007 at 1:21 pm
I’m shocked that someone was able to get a fanfic book published.
I’ve seen some really well written fanfic. Much better than that book.
Fanfic is okay as long as the person doesn’t start believing their own story. Because, I have seen crazies do that too.
Fandom can be one scary place.
October 19, 2007 at 1:22 pm
she’s a lie–Book wasn’t written by anyone on Boog.
Someone annouced it over there, and most of them thought it was nutty too.
Strange thing about the person who wrote that, she can write, she did a nice interview with Taylor once and her myspace is very good. A little to super religious for my personal taste but she has great pictures and music. A very entertaining myspace. Seems like she just let this one paticular fantasy get the best of her better judgment.
I wish at the very least she would have given her character a completely different name and not made it so totally obvious. Poor Taylor.
October 19, 2007 at 2:19 pm
JAT - thanks, I stand corrected. I just find this fan fiction stuff a bit extreme IMO. One thing to think or dream a fantasy, but to put in on paper for everyone to read and see, I just find unsettling. And I agree, a different character name would have been a much better choice, Taylor must be rolling over this one.
October 19, 2007 at 2:22 pm
I think it’s his southern drawl that makes him pronounce her name wrong.
Nope, since other Southerners have no problem pronouncing her name or other words that end in an “s.” It’s his unfamiliarity with her and saying her name that caused him to mispronounce it.
His being fidgety is nothing new. He’s been that way since the first time most of us laid eyes on him.
Not like this. He was on the Tonight Show for goodness sakes, the biggest show on latenight tv, and he wasn’t jumping out of his skin the way he was here. There he looked at ease, here he was squirming…because of the TOPIC.
Besides the fact that she looked like a boy next to him, they both looked uneasy and uncomfortable.
I just busted the case wide open: CL is actually Taylor’s illegitimate son from a one night stand years ago who’s come to lay claim to his fortune!!!!
October 19, 2007 at 2:28 pm
Something I was thinking of last night, IMO this whole marine/giraffe/fg business is pretty fricking lame. How do we know marine is a “bad” girl that he didn’t want an association with. Why was CL brought into this mix to cover? I think whether he was with marine, CL and has probably been with 100 other women this summer, it just is so over the top to put on a charade like this. Honestly, who cares who he is seeing, sleeping with whatever. I don’t. Was this shit brought out just for entertainment? I mean honestly, what reason could he have for perpetrating his bs. For attention, or to cover up something much larger that people know about and aren’t willing to divulge.
October 19, 2007 at 2:48 pm
DL,
That’s my sense as well. It was a really stupid decision, compounded over time by the fumbling dance-step answers to interviewers and then the boutwell lie. Many fans picked up on parts of the deceit but the whole sham would have worked and been laid to rest over time except for MFOYA resurrecting it and laying it out for fans to see. There’s karma at work for you.
October 19, 2007 at 2:51 pm
DL,
A photo is worth a thousand words. Don’t you think Taylor and CL standing on a stage clasping hands in front of hundreds of applauding fans would have made the relationship as ‘official’ as it could get? It would have been a powerful moment in the sham strategy. Taylor saying: “she’s here somewhere” didn’t have the same effect. For some reason, CL balked at the pivotal moment in the spotlight…
October 19, 2007 at 2:54 pm
I just find it so hard to fathom this bs. A game like this imo shows a lack of maturity and being naive. Hope he gets back on track and soon before too much damage has been done. hope we aren’t all in for another sham surprise.
October 19, 2007 at 2:57 pm
votem, dl:
yea, when you watch that video aside from his being nervous as a cat, now I know he is not very good at interviews, but if she was his gf, wouldn’t he have said, honey, darling, whatever come on up here? She wouldn’t have to steal the spotlight, just say hello and go or whatever. Reading the faces and body language of the people in the audience, they sure as hell didn’t look like they wanted her to get up there, the applause was fake. Maybe they all knew and everyone seemed very uncomfortable with the situation especially Taylor.
October 19, 2007 at 3:03 pm
DL,
Ok, maybe, but Boutwell was at the very end of July. Of course when fans started complaining about the missing body language, some of that started to be displayed for the fans’ benefit in August/Sept.
October 19, 2007 at 3:05 pm
she’s a lie,
Taylor’s credibility is all gone now, at least it is for me. I’m going to be second-guessing everything that comes out of his mouth now. Who knows what else Taylor has been lying about.
October 19, 2007 at 3:09 pm
she’s a lie,
Poster ‘Too Obvious’ who was at Boutwell was saying when Taylor made the CL response as shown on the video, it seemed like the room went ‘weird’ and like the oxygen was sucked out of it at that moment. They said it sort of spoiled the rest of the event. Maybe some sensed something was wrong with his response and some just knew he had lied to cover up the sham. Obviously none would have felt this way if the whole g/f thing had been real.